Hardware Analysis Community Forums http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/ 2008-12-03T17:00:39-05:00 http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/ http://media.hardwareanalysis.com/halogo.gif text/html 2004-05-20T21:45:45-05:00 Shadow_Ops_Airman1 http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#136500 The Way Its Meant To Be Played, is truly a sales gimmick. text/html 2004-05-20T20:34:23-05:00 Troy Eckert http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#136491 Well all I have to say is Im going with ATI this time. I bought one of those GeForceFX 5900 Ultra's and this thing has been a nightmare ever since. First I need a new power supply, then my hard drive crashed because the damn thing kept rebooting because of not enough power. They never bothered to tell you what exactly power supply you needed! To much work, I just wanted it for games!<br /> <br /> Then they said the exact same thing before, it needs driver updates. Well here we are, months later, still no real driver updates! The thing still doesnt look as good as the 9700Pro I had installed. Loud as hell of course. Doesnt sound as bad as the dust buster FX, but It can compete! Games still run bad as far as Im concerned, only the ones &quot;specifcally&quot; designed for Nvidia or whatever the hell that means, and I dont really care, I just want it to run well.<br /> <br /> So basically Nvidia has another card, where we have to wait AGAIN for updated drivers in order to use the card to its potential, proboly gonna take another 6 months, then they will have their next card...blah blah blah...you know the rest. ATI's card may or may not have headroom, or the potential to grow, but you get what you pay for now! Not 6 months down the road, when your just gonna buy a new card again anyway.<br /> <br /> So ATI has my vote this time, because Nvidia just doesn't have it right. Everytime I buy a Nvidia card that is &quot;supposed&quot; to be the best card turns out to be a puff of smoke...we shall see... text/html 2004-05-14T09:48:21-05:00 Shadow_Ops_Airman1 http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134590 anymore to get great performance text/html 2004-05-14T09:46:40-05:00 Shadow_Ops_Airman1 http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134589 well it was about time that ATI took the Top actually, it should open new avenues for gamers cause u dont have to buy from just 1 vid card company. text/html 2004-05-13T18:53:29-05:00 Karl Carroll http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134390 It is my understanding that the next core out will be the mods on the 420 and then the 480. The 5xx series isn't due out until next year based on what I have been able to find out through reading and talking with friends.<br /> <br /> As for the designations of the various cards I believe that the Platinum designation is just a term specific to the HIS company and not an official Radeon suffix identifier. The &quot;official&quot; identifiers for the Radeon series of cards are SE, NON-PRO or no suffix, PRO, and XT. Various other suppliers have come up with thier own superlative identifiers such as HIS's Platinum and Sapphire's Ultimate but they are not official, widely accepted, or well defined.<br /> <br /> With the NVidia series of cards you have a similar situation in that the accepted suffix identifiers are LE, no suffix and Ultra but you will also see individual companies adding there own identifiers. XT for instance, on an NVidia card, usually means nothing or is even used instead of the lower rated LE suffix.<br /> <br /> Performance wise I still believe that either card is a good product and that if you compare the top 6800Ultra with the top X800XT you will get similar numbers and almost equal in game performance when compared over a broad spectrum of games and game engines. I like the ATI card because I already have an ATI and it is a single slot solution with less power consumption than the NVidia 6800 Ultra. A lot of users tho won't care about the double slot issue or the extra power consumption and for them the NVidia 6800 Ultra is going to look more attractive than it does to me.<br /> <br /> I don't think you can cite driver differences between the two cards any longer. Both ATI Catalyst and NVidia Detonator or Forceware drivers are well supported and relatively easy to install. Neither is bug free and both are getting better all the time.<br /> <br /> For those that are calling these latest cards stepping stones and trying to make a case for waiting till the next big thing comes along I have to differ. It has been a long time since any graphic card came out that completely doubled performance over the last generation and if ever there was a good reason to upgrade these current cards definately make the case. I bought a 9800 Pro about 8 months ago and I plan to buy an ATI X800XT as soon as they are available.<br /> <br /> In the end tho, these are just video cards we are talking about and not life and death decisions so lets try and not be quite so hostile over this thread. <br /> <br /> Peace,<br /> <br /> EB text/html 2004-05-13T12:08:45-05:00 Rory Witham http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134270 ________ I would be careful to what card your buying______________<br /> <br /> I have been reading the test results for the x800 pro the 6800 U as I have a selling policy to check out all the goods making sure there &quot;good enough&quot; to be sold by me..<br /> Price wise the x800 PRO wins hands down, but with the X800 chip set being of the old R420 i would be considering the R5xx type chip if I wanted a new GPU. i am wondering, as its not been to clear which card has which chip, there is difference by manufacture, and card model extensions type. (XT, PRO, Plat edition)<br /> but it seams as the Plat is the better card from the range (at first glance)<br /> <br /> to match bang for buck, it would be the x800. as Ive not seen to many cards up for sale and limits made for the sale of the top end X800 card being around 11k. I would expect this will be from the cards being re-releaced later this year with the new chip set making the card, even better.<br /> <br /> from what i have seen the X800 gives you an extra 50 % on the 9800 XT card<br /> with the balance of the card being close but not close enough for me to say that the X800 is a card which is the best of great.<br /> <br /> Conclusion:<br /> <br /> If you want to step up your Graphics card from a 9800 XT then its not a bad move. If your looking for a great graphics card, you will still have to wait, if you cant, you should consider the 6800 U graphics card.<br /> <br /> I would like to say, the X800 XT is a top margin with the 6800u but there is a difference which match the 6800 and x800 on all bench test however there are both high and low results form the cards making them not equal performer on different games how ever the most part you will not see any difference between most games you will be playing this year.<br /> Keep your eyes out for the x800 plat ed. as this would be a better option. than the other X800 cards. but i would wait on this one till later in the year for the X800 R5xx chipsets to see how they perform before making a final decision. text/html 2004-05-13T11:10:49-05:00 Matt BillyBob http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134264 Naturally theres more to drivers 4 running a decent system. Nevertheless, theres really not a great deal of point bagging out the FX (particularly the smaller grades). I run a basic 2ghz sytem with an evil fx5200 but i still run close to all games decently including farcry and watnot without having to waste money on upgrading that really isnt going to create a giant difference, at least for another year while games and processors catch up to graphics cards. Look at system configuration before you spend over $250 on a new card. Nor is there a giant need to reuire full detial on every little section of a game. In all seriousness, unless you really need antialiasing theres really no point clogging up your GPU for the smallest details imaginable. I personally think these new series of stepping stone cards will be nothing but bragging material for the next year at least text/html 2004-05-12T23:39:43-05:00 SombaSan http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134116 Dale you seem a bit to byass with Nvidia, <br /> <br /> however ATi has had Great products and you dont know if they were getting lazy because you dont work for them 4 years in a row ever since our little friend the 9700 pro showed up in the ring Nvidia has been struggling to get off thats why they were so quick into making killing misktakes with their FX series starting with the 5800. My 4200ti could beat the 5200 in many test and sure did!! If its drivers you say will make the difference for Nvidia this time because i dont know about you but recently most of my D3D games like Hitman Contracts and Ut2k4 have been freezing while in play. So anyone can argue that both companies have driver issues but its the card that counts and i think in my opinon that ATi will come out on top only because Nvidia plans to work off their new chip while the 420 series is just a remake of the 350 series still carrying 24bit arch. and 2.0 pixel shaders while and Nvidia carries 32 and 3.0 ofcourse because this is their new chip. Allowing them to make mistakes while ATi just sits back and watches before they release thier 480 which is their totally new redesigned chip and wacthing Nvidia make mistakes. <br /> However of course this is just my opinion and i respect yours. <br /> peace <br /> Nuff said <br /> somba.inc<br /> &quot;seeing both perspectives is the only way to slove an agurement&quot; text/html 2004-05-12T19:40:12-05:00 Dale Maxim http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#134032 I have a Voodoo 5500 in my 750 mhz machine I use for server testing. Only takes 1 slot if you got the AGP version. Runs great. text/html 2004-05-12T15:51:03-05:00 chas P http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#133997 3dfx came out with their voodoo 5500?? which required a nuclear plant to power them and 2 pci slots, guess what happened to them.<br /> <br /> is it wise to jump on the 32-bit rendering when people say you can hardly notice 16-bit and 24-bit color.<br /> <br /> i think you might see Big Blue take on ATI next time round <img src="http://media.hardwareanalysis.com/smilies/smile5.gif" width="14" height="14" border="0" alt=":P" title=":P"> text/html 2004-05-11T19:43:05-05:00 Dale Maxim http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=40#133782 The power consumption thing is NVidia being safe. They suggest a 480 PSU because they expect people who buy the 6800 ultra to have their machines outfitted like crazy. If you have a 3.4 ghz cpu, 2 gigs of ram, 2 hard drives, 2 cdroms, a sound blaster audigy platinum 2, 50 case fans... I have 12 so =)... etc etc your going to need that power. Tally up the power consumption of your machine before you go buy a 480w. If you already have somewhere around a 420 or 440 you might not need a new one anyway. As for performance. Most of the benches where ATI leads it's usually under 10 frames. As for that 3dmark score, they were so overclocked out the rear it's not realistic to a consumer. When you get 60 frames vs 65 though that's about a 10% difference. Frame difference, hardly any, they just use percents to make it sound big. Nvidia already released drivers that kicked there FPS up a nice chunk. If it really is such an unpolished diamond who really knows what they'll actually wind up at. They've already learned to keep some information secret because ATI likes to wait till they've shown all their cards. I'd expect them to hide their latest and greatest drivers till the home stretch of the race. Driver wise, honestly, ATI hasn't had the best record. I admit they're better but for every person that has absolutely no issues there are plenty more that have to change drivers when they want to play different games. Tricky business practices by NVidia are way different than getting a $500 dollar product that makes you wanna pull your hair out. The FX line was a giant expensive paperweight though. I stuck with my TI4600, I love my GF4. May not be the fastest ,but it ain't the slowest and it never has any driver issues. I might upgrade this time. Kinda waiting to see what PCI Express does. Everyone has driver problems sometimes. ATI just tends to wind up with a nice chunk more. My hat is off to them for their great achievement but in the end NVidia will probably end up on top again just because of their sheer magnitude of resources to pull ideas from. They got lazy and ATI bushwhacked them. It was a good learning experience for them. Who knows. I didn't get an FX so maybe I'm not mad at NVidia because of it. *shrugs* text/html 2004-05-09T23:32:07-05:00 SombaSan http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=20#133190 Ignorant people like you need to go else where with your ignorant harsh language i happen to be black and i think thats fine that they put a black person on an advertisment, ur current comments just show me how imature and stupid you are. You commented on just MPEG encoders that have never gone wrong with my 9700pro AIW and the guy above me never seems to have any problems either. <br /> You dip S@#$ your mom should have taught you more manners on how to approache a topic and not to be rude if your just discussing on a fourm. I happen to own a 4200Ti which seems to work just fine 4 now on my other pc. your ignorance is just bliss. go pary. and ask God for forgiveness. Ive really never talked to anyone as stupied at disscussing a topic as you I wonder if with your big mouth have you have owned an AIW since you talk so much about them. I should assume no since you assumed i never owned a Nvidia and No your 5900 can not compete with my speed of my new 9800 pro. <br /> <br /> By the way i never had a problem with any drivers with my ATI however my Ti would freeze after a while in most D3D games oh wait i think think my statement almost maches the statement above by someone else do i see a trend?? <br /> <br /> somba.inc <br /> nuffsaid <br /> &quot;the only way to slove an agurement is to see both points of view&quot;<br /> <br /> oh ya i almost 4 go too say my off topic &quot;where are u from to tell ATI why thier represented by a black instead of a white nerd fag who has nothing else to do but to jack off to his Computer and get angry about not seeing his race on the adverts. <br /> text/html 2004-05-09T03:02:20-05:00 Karl Carroll http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=20#132989 Well I have gone thru three All In Wonders and not one of them failed in any way. Never known of anyone that did have one fail. Not that I don't believe that there were failures, just that none of the people I installed them for had any problems, and that would amount to about a dozen different clients.<br /> <br /> I personally have never had any trouble with a Radeon card of any type other than driver issues with the pre-catalyst drivers. As far as the hardware is concerned I have never had a failure. I can't say the same for all NVidias but the TI series were exceptionally stable and dependable. It wasn't until the 5800 that I heard of any major issues. I did have a GeForce 2 that fried but it was over-clocked on occasion so I don't fault the design.<br /> <br /> As for company policies I think both NVidia and ATI have been guilty of less than honorable business practices. ATI has just learned from NVidia that you never release your card first. I remember how NVidia tweaked thier drivers to make the GeForce 3 look much better than the Radeon 8500 when in reality they were pretty comparable GPUs. Neither company earns any points for honorable business policies.<br /> <br /> I think which ever card you get you can rest assured it will be twice as powerful as what you have now and if it's bragging rights you are looking for you can make a case for either card.<br /> <br /> EB text/html 2004-05-09T00:34:07-05:00 Sean B http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=20#132970 Um, the AiW is a very risky venture. You're paying $100-$200 (and the first AiW was at least $250 more) more than just buying an ATI. You might reap a few benefits of having an onboard tuner, but what if something goes wrong? The first AiW had a lot of reports of failure, either due to the tuner or GPU giving out.<br /> Granted, warranties will cover this, but the card shouldn't be failing in the first place.<br /> <br /> <br /> You should've never mentioned it. Now I have to go off on you about how the video functions of the All In Wonder DONT AFFECT COMPUTER VIDEO RENDERING! The old models had an onboard MPEG2 encoder, and the new ones boast an MPEG4 encoder... but they absolutely do not help with DVD or any other video format's playback. The MPEG encoder is only for the coaxial/rca/svideo-INs, not out, and they are not used for video rendering, only processing.<br /> <br /> <br /> At 4x-s aa/4x aniso, my card can match or beat a Radeon set to 6x aa/6x aniso.<br /> <br /> <br /> You've obviously never owned an Nvidia card, and until you have don't write checks your @$$ can't cash.<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> One more thing to point out, but it's off topic: This is the first time I've seen a black person in a computer advertisement. I'm not certain ATI is representing the right demographic for their X800. text/html 2004-05-08T20:22:02-05:00 SombaSan http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/26401/?o=20#132916 Well the statement about ATI and Nvidia is true and strategically ATi is very smart beating the bigger stronger more wealthy-er at the momment big brother. <br /> However if you want good image quality and exellent DVD play back the card to get is also the ATi and i think you left that out only because they made a little card called the All in wonder. And a 420watt power supplie supports a althon 64 (2800+) quiet well considering conqesedentlly i have that CPU it only uses about 55-60watts of my power suppliy. and yes i have it clocked to 2.2Ghz and it runs as a 3200 64s speeds. <br /> <br /> Somba.inc<br /> nuffsaid<br /> &quot;the only way to solve and argurment is seeing both perspectives&quot;