Hardware Analysis - Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

MrBungle — 2005-10-24T09:09:45-05:00

Did i ever say that total war was a good thing? No... I was simply making a statement pertaining to the idea that technology and industrial capcity had nothing to do with the militaristic abilities of a nation.

I neither wish to be involved in nor advocate such a war, and i agree that we should try to avoid conflict whenever possible. But if someone comes out making a statement that I see as being false, im going to give an example why that is wrong.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Gerritt — 2005-10-24T06:49:15-05:00

Jim,
So, Annihilation or Total War is a good thing?
Granted, it is the politicians that start wars, and once started shoud establish goals. The achievment of these goals is the responsibility of the military.
I spent 10 years in the military, and I was taught that the primary objective of the military was to AVOID conflict, loss of life, etc. In order to do so we must appear stronger than any of our possible enimies.
While I was in, MAD, or Mutually Assured Distrruction, was the accepted norm.
While I was in, MAD was proven to be a p**s poor way of carrying on diplomatic or economic discourse.
Crazy as it is, the USA and the USSR found that it was too expensive to ensure MAD, so started working together.
We can destroy any civilizatoin. Any civilization can destroy us.
We, as Americans, or USA citizens have given up so many rights so we can be safe from the Moslem Boogyman, that we are no longer safe from our own government!
BUT WE have a SELF PROCLAIMED "CHRISTIAN" President, and most of our Congress and court follow suit.

It's sad really.

Gerritt

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

MrBungle — 2005-10-24T05:39:16-05:00

double post my bad...

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

MrBungle — 2005-10-24T05:38:24-05:00

~~~Nope Technology & Industry makes War easy but it dosent makes you win a War~~~

That, is actually a conditionally true statement, it can be true if you are in a restricted or "pulled punches war". Which is a situation where group X doesn't use every available means to completely anniahlate group Y.

If the war is total then it is virtully impossible for the more industrious more technological nation to loose.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Gerritt — 2005-10-24T01:30:50-05:00

OK,
Time for a bit of obscene language....
f**k all of this finger pointing s**t that seems to be the f**kING basis of indiscrete understandings of different Religeons and/or Societies!
Over what seems to be a rather moderate posting that indicated that folks, or at least one person of Islamic beliefs could correlate his beliefs with scientific understanding, and wished to pass on this understanding; we've (a supposedly technological community) persecuted him for his post. This shouldn't be a platform for censorship of any viewpoint, and should be there for the transfer of ideas.

Whether this be Religion, or ATI vs NVidia, or Intel vs AMI, this was posted in the correct area of the HWA bulletin board. It is for the free exchange of information or understanding, on several layers that HWA exist. The "Off Topic" segment is a perfect area for us "techies" from all backgrounds to express our opinions.

It is sad that "religion" is a "FANBOY" or "FANGIRL" discussion that brings to it the same unmittigated bigotry as the other "this is what I own/believe, so everyone else is wrong, no matter what" mentalities.

If you want me to believe the same as you, you can express your opinion or belief.
If you want to force me to believe what you do....f**k OFF!

Don't get me wrong...you may be right, but you don't have the right to judge me, no matter what you believe....EVER.

Gerritt

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

A_Pickle — 2005-10-23T22:37:54-05:00

QUOTE: "what had Iraq had to do with 9/11?"

I never said Iraq had anything to do with 9/11. I said that without the events that occurred on 9/11, we wouldn't have invaded Iraq. The very instant 9/11, the battlefield of the 21st century was placed on the soil of the Middle East. Last time I checked, Iraq is in the Middle East.

Iraq didn't have anything directly to do with 9/11 that I know of, but because of the repercussions in international politics and militarism that occured post-9/11, Iraq was an American target. We pushed back the invasion date four or five times to give Saddam MORE time to reconsider his decision NOT to let the UN weapons inspectors in.

_________________
QUOTE: "Do you think the same about the 7000+ killed in Iraq who have nothing to do with 9/11"

Oh, yeah, definitely. I feel horribly sorry for the innocents who've lost loved ones by a US weapon over in Iraq. It's quite sad. But, like I said, we wouldn't have been there if Saddam let the UN weapons inspectors in, and we wouldn't have been there had not 9/11 occurred.

I might add, we didn't intentionally go out and kill 7,000 people, these casualties take place when someone is in the wrong place in the wrong time. Trust me, America has NO intention of using a 20 million dollar precision weapon to bomb some civilians house for the hell of it.

Now let me ask you something. I left out a fairly important fact when saying the total civilian casualties in Iraq -- it's closer to 30,000. 7,000 of them have been killed by American weapons, the other 23,000 have been killed in firefights (in which both the US and Insurgents are guilty) and finally, roadside bombs, mortars, car bombs and suicide bombers.

That means, insurgents have, without regard to their countrymen, targeted and attacked American operations, EVEN IF IT MEANS KILLING IRAQI CITIZENS. So, that's 2,000 people on 9/11 and god knows how many in Iraq. Do you feel sorry that they died from an insurgent bomb?

_________________
QUOTE: "Neither do i,Just want you to understand the whole scenario"

There's a lot to it. Believe me, I think Osama bin Laden has a lot of valid arguments against the United States. We're not perfect. Don't delude yourself into thinking the Islamic countries of the world ARE. No one is, and, as they say, the issue is NOT black and white.

I'm simply arguing that after 9/11, I have very little respect or time for the goals of the other side.

_________________
QUOTE: "if you know the history of muslims the first War foughted by muslims where 300 barely armed Muslims Defeated the mighty well equipped army of Quraish thats an inspiration to us all Muslims."

Precisely. Now, why is that event significant?

_________________
QUOTE: "Lol US army uses Brave pills which have more sideeffects than advantages LOL"

I dare you to tell that to a US Marine.

_________________
QUOTE: "you people are the real extremists who supports the murdering of innocents"

Hardly. We didn't kill innocents first. 9/11 came before Afghanistan and Iraq. You have a problem with America supplying Israel weapons, then come and say something on the global stage, or fight the Israelis who are using the weaponry.

The people in the twin towers were not harming Islam in any way. Unfortunately, Islam harmed them that day, and now, yes, we are in Iraq. And innocent Iraqi people are dying, from American and insurgent attacks all the same. But, the fact is, you fired the first shot.

_________________
QUOTE: "Talibans were ready to expell Al-Qaeda out of their country do you know that??No Cnn didnt showed that."

If that were true, provide some of the "true" evidence.

_________________
QUOTE: "Yep Freedom means spreading weapons??"

Freedom means being free. Meaning, we have the right to choice. Fighting for it means spreading weapons, to both sides. As has been seen, time and time again, Islamic nations use American weapons just as Israel does.

_________________
QUOTE: "Lol Israel turnedback just because they were less in numbers they were unable to Invade Egypt thats why,"

Yes, they had smaller numbers and a better trained and more advanced army. And they still kicked both Syria and Egypt back, and frankly, your claims that Israel "couldn't" invade Egypt are unsubstantiated. Think of it. Israel wasn't TRYING to invade Egypt. They know, better than you or any other Islamic nation, that they don't have the military numbers or reliable supply routes to maintain a successful offensive. In addition, Israel knew that there would be an insurgent uprising, much like today in Iraq, that they couldn't handle at ALL because of the small size of this hypothetical invasion force.

Israel wasn't trying to invade Egypt, they knew they couldn't have succeeded in doing it.

_________________
QUOTE: "The Suiside bombing is the resistance & those Israelis including civilians are the invaders of their Land should they just accept that their land is occupied & surrender?"

"Their" land? The land is as sacred and as holy to the Jews as it is to the Muslims. International politics gave the land to the Jews in 1945, because the Jews had NO STATE in which to call home. They were being exiled and persecuted everywhere -- and now, they are being terrorized in their own home. It's their land according to politics AND their religion, which means if you'd like SOME of it under a Muslim government, terrorism (excuse me, "resistance") isn't going to get it back. Particularly when this "resistance" entails killing off defenseless people inside buses -- they haven't taken away your land. It's not their fault they were born in Israel.

I completely agree that Palestine needs to exist, because as much claim as Jews have to this holy land, Muslims do too. Frankly, I don't see what the big deal is. Muslims are free to practice their religion in Israel, and the Muslim holy sites are left alone by Jews, unless they're curious and want to get a look at the beliefs of the other relgions.

You want to be taken seriously? Drop your guns like the mature culture you CAN be and step up to the political plate.

_________________
QUOTE: "Lol What makes you think Pakistan cannot destroy this world ten times??MIRVs Pakistan got those on their Shaheen3 a Solid engine & the warheads are so advance that they can dodge anysort of obstackle so you be in fantasy world LOL"

Oh, that's funny. The Shaheen 3 is an intermediate range ballistic missile with a maximum range of 2,000 miles and a maximum payload of 1,000 pounds.

Your fabled Babur "stealth" missile isn't stealth at all. It's a Pakistani cruise missile, with a maximum effective range of 310 miles. It's payload is 400kg, or roughly 882 pounds.

Contrast that with the Peacekeeper intercontinental ballistic missile, which has a maximum effective range of 6,380 miles and a maximum payload of 4,700 pounds. The Peacekeepr also has the advantage in that we're certain it's going to at least launch properly.

You are horribly deluded if you seem to think the Islamic countries of the world have ANY sort of military edge. This would be what is known as a "fantasy world," as you so put it.

Peacekeeper missile info.
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Usa/Weapons/Mx.html

Shaheen-3 missile info:
http://www.astronautix.com/lvs/shaheen3.htm

_________________
QUOTE: "Dont Forget pakistani UAVs even America uses pakistan UAVs to monitor their Borders LOL some Third word country Pakistan"

You're just an idiot if you deny it otherwise. Pakistan. Is. A third world country.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Josh — 2005-10-23T21:50:57-05:00

"By the way what have you done when America was hit by these Hurricane?Left it on your Govt??"
If I could help, I would. But right now, there's not much I can do.
The Government should not be doing as much as they are, in my opinion. If someone's house burns down, is the government going to rebuild a house for them? Nope. They either need to use their insurance, or pay for the rebuilding themselves. So, why is the government helping those whose houses washed away? So, if one person is affected, who cares; but if a million people are affected, then the government will take care of all of them?

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

AZEEM — 2005-10-23T17:10:57-05:00

One morething i wanna tell you just for the info is that Pakistan had successfully tested Nuclear Fission & Nuclear Fusion & pakistan is capable of Demonstrating H-Bomb anytime but economic embargoes scuks Dr.Abdul Qadeer told me that when he came to my school 4years ago

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

AZEEM — 2005-10-23T17:00:05-05:00

~~~~~~What if I had died in 9/11? What the hell had I done against you or your people to warrant that? I have a girlfriend
I'm gonna go see in a few weeks, that I wouldn't have been able to care for or to love for ever if I died in 9/11. Now,
I'm asking you, what the hell did any of those 2,000 people do that was helpful to Israel or detrimental to Islam? How
did they deserve to die?~~~~~~
awwwwwwwwww what a pity well i wasent the first to support the terrorists u flame the fire by supporting the war on Iraq now u answer me first that what had Iraq had to do with 9/11??What has Taliban & Afghanistan has to do with 9/11??Talibans were ready to expell Al-Qaeda out of their country do you know that??No Cnn didnt showed that.

~~~~~~~~I'll tell you, they didn't. They went to work, on what they thought was a normal day in their country. They'd go home
and that would be that, 'til the next day. But, no. They never got to see their friends and families, they never got that
next day at work. No, instead they died any number of horrific ways, from burning to death from the flaming jet fuel or
dying as the weight of a 1,000,000+ ton structure collapsed on them.~~~~~~~~
Do you think the same about the 7000+ killed in Iraq who have nothing to do with 9/11

~~~~~You don't see me wishing (or, for that matter, carrying out) death upon you, do you?~~~~~~~~
Neither do i,Just want you to understand the whole scenario

~~~~~~~~~I don't know you, and you've never done me any harm. Yes, I'm frustrated at the relations between the Middle East and
the West, and frankly both sides have done stupid s**t to eachother. It's time to put the damn guns away and resolve
this conflict as the civilized human beings we so claim we are.~~~~~~~~~
Now youve proven yourself to be smart thats what i wants from ya

~~~~~~~~Yes, it is. War is won by industry and technology. The bigger of two armies will emerge on top -- unless one army is
armed with sticks and the other is armed with machine guns. Technology and industry is what wins wars, that's why everyone
makes a big deal whenever a smaller or less technologically advanced foe wins. It's news when a small force successfully
defeats a large force, because it rarely happens.~~~~~~
Nope Technology & Industry makes War easy but it dosent makes you win a War,if you know the history of muslims the first War foughted by muslims where 300 barely armed Muslims Defeated the mighty well equipped army of Quraish thats an inspiration to us all Muslims.Technology is good but Braveness is the Best

~~~~~~Industry and technology wins wars. Strategy is a distant third.~~~~~~~
You are wrong there buddy.think about a coward person equipped with M-16 vs a Brave & Intelligent person with a stick.Lol US army uses Brave pills which have more sideeffects than advantages LOL

~~~~~~Well, yeah, I guess we are still looking for Osama. But, at the same time, he just runs away and hides in caves, so he's
not too big of a threat. On the flip side, entire Iraqi battalions that surrender before any shots are fired seems to
really indicate WE'RE the ones that're crying...~~~~~~~~
Hiding can be a good strategy he is counterattacking also see the documentary on BBC when they were saying that Karzai is only a Mayor of Kabul rest of the Afghanistan is controlled by Warlords & Taliban & in the Areas of Taliban no American Hellies dare to go LOL.as i said before Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 & whoever is killed by US army in Iraq is very Unjust i cant believe how peole support such a thing we Muslims dont supports attacks on 9/11 but you people are the real extremists who supports the murdering of innocents

~~~~~~Yep. Freedom isn't free.~~~~~~~
Yep Freedom means spreading weapons??

~~~~~~~~That's the kicker, see? Israel hasn't gone and killed 2,000 innocents.~~~~~~~~
Massacre @ Genine refugee caps etc there are many examples as i said before one must be Dumb Deff or blind to not know what Israel is doing

~~~~~~~. Egypt, of course, with the help of Syria tried to invade Israel during the Six Days War, during which both those nations got their collective clocks cleaned by 'lil Israel.

Frankly, Israel hasn't gone and attacked thousands of people who can't shoot back. It's one thing to go after a military
target -- they can defend themselves. It's quite something else to shoot at civilians, who have no reasonable means to
defend against, oh, I don't know, maybe an airliner headed straight for them.~~~~~~~~
Lol Israel turnedback just because they were less in numbers they were unable to Invade Egypt thats why,But If there was a heavy population present then we would here be talking about Egypt as a Palestine

~~~~~and a government that doesn't endorse terrorism.~~~~~
Sorry myfriend if you calls those suiside bombers Terrorists than i dont agree with you.The Suiside bombing is the resistance & those Israelis including civilians are the invaders of their Land should they just accept that their land is occupied & surrender??No they should fight with whatever tactics & i supports them

~~~~~~~~Heh, just try to match the US nuclear arsenal, buddy. If you even think you've got the firepower to match, think again.
We can wipe out the world ten times over. In addition, the nukes on our soil can hit any point on the Earth, anywhere,
anytime with little chance of being shot down. In addition to that, we use MIRVs (multiple independently targeted
reentry vehicles), of which the Peacekeeper missile is capable of carrying ten of. With one rocket, we can turn ten
cities into ten craters.~~~~~~~
Lol What makes you think Pakistan cannot destroy this world ten times??MIRVs Pakistan got those on their Shaheen3 a Solid engine & the warheads are so advance that they can dodge anysort of obstackle so you be in fantasy world LOL

~~~~~~If an Islamic country has nukes, it's Pakistan, which also doesn't have the technology to deply nuclear weapons on a
long range basis.~~~~~~~
LoL Do you know Pakistan had recently tested a Stealth Cruise missile named BABUR search it on the web you'll find it interesting especially the SUb launched Version also Pakistan got Agousta90B
& Dont Forget pakistani UAVs even America uses pakistan UAVs to monitor their Borders LOL some Third word country Pakistan

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

A_Pickle — 2005-10-23T15:30:41-05:00

QUOTE: "Lol man i thought you were Smart but nah your just a frustrated one"

Yeah, to be honest, I am a little frustrated.

What if I had died in 9/11? What the hell had I done against you or your people to warrant that? I have a girlfriend I'm gonna go see in a few weeks, that I wouldn't have been able to care for or to love for ever if I died in 9/11. Now, I'm asking you, what the hell did any of those 2,000 people do that was helpful to Israel or detrimental to Islam? How did they deserve to die?

I'll tell you, they didn't. They went to work, on what they thought was a normal day in their country. They'd go home and that would be that, 'til the next day. But, no. They never got to see their friends and families, they never got that next day at work. No, instead they died any number of horrific ways, from burning to death from the flaming jet fuel or dying as the weight of a 1,000,000+ ton structure collapsed on them. You don't see me wishing (or, for that matter, carrying out) death upon you, do you?

I don't know you, and you've never done me any harm. Yes, I'm frustrated at the relations between the Middle East and the West, and frankly both sides have done stupid s**t to eachother. It's time to put the damn guns away and resolve this conflict as the civilized human beings we so claim we are.

QUOTE: "War is won by strategies not just by Weaponry."

Yes, it is. War is won by industry and technology. The bigger of two armies will emerge on top -- unless one army is armed with sticks and the other is armed with machine guns. Technology and industry is what wins wars, that's why everyone makes a big deal whenever a smaller or less technologically advanced foe wins. It's news when a small force successfully defeats a large force, because it rarely happens.

Industry and technology wins wars. Strategy is a distant third.

QUOTE: "You got weapons state of the Art ones & still you are crying Whele ig Oshama? LOL"

Well, yeah, I guess we are still looking for Osama. But, at the same time, he just runs away and hides in caves, so he's not too big of a threat. On the flip side, entire Iraqi battalions that surrender before any shots are fired seems to really indicate WE'RE the ones that're crying...

QUOTE: "Frankly,i dont like Violence but sometimes violence is essential for those who dont understands what is said to them, "

Yep. Freedom isn't free.

QUOTE: "If peace you want then appologize & stop aiding our enemies"

That's the kicker, see? Israel hasn't gone and killed 2,000 innocents. For one, the United States is more willing to cooperate and interact with nations that have stable governments. The only Islamic nations with decently stable governments are Egypt and Pakistan, and we're on pretty good terms with Pakistan. Egypt, of course, with the help of Syria tried to invade Israel during the Six Days War, during which both those nations got their collective clocks cleaned by 'lil Israel.

Frankly, Israel hasn't gone and attacked thousands of people who can't shoot back. It's one thing to go after a military target -- they can defend themselves. It's quite something else to shoot at civilians, who have no reasonable means to defend against, oh, I don't know, maybe an airliner headed straight for them.

The United States is much more willing to work with Prime Minister Abbas, the man is willing to compromise (the very idea ov which is the backbone of politics) unlike his predecessor, Yasser Arafat (who is, thankfully, no longer in the business of impeding Middle East politics). All it takes is a professional government willing to accept change, and a government that doesn't endorse terrorism.

QUOTE: "Bythe way we also got Nukes what makes you think after nuking Makkah you'll be safe"

Heh, just try to match the US nuclear arsenal, buddy. If you even think you've got the firepower to match, think again. We can wipe out the world ten times over. In addition, the nukes on our soil can hit any point on the Earth, anywhere, anytime with little chance of being shot down. In addition to that, we use MIRVs (multiple independently targeted reentry vehicles), of which the Peacekeeper missile is capable of carrying ten of. With one rocket, we can turn ten cities into ten craters.

If an Islamic country has nukes, it's Pakistan, which also doesn't have the technology to deply nuclear weapons on a long range basis.

Ahh, gotta love the capabilities of an overprioritized military budget.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

varun rao — 2005-10-23T14:21:24-05:00

this is not a healthy arguement at all.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

AZEEM — 2005-10-23T14:12:16-05:00

~~~~Yeah, but are they handling it like the US is? I don't think so.~~~~
Actually much better read about what karachiites have done for their troubled countrymen
The Whole country stood Volunteers spread over & did all the rescue & relief work etc
I also loaded many Trucks for free
By the way what have you done when America was hit by these Hurricane?Left it on your Govt??

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Josh — 2005-10-23T14:04:14-05:00

"~~~~~~~I'd love to see an Islamic country handle it the way this country has.~~~~~~
Yeah Pakistan people are alredy handling much bigger Disaster than Tsunami"
Yeah, but are they handling it like the US is? I don't think so.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

Super XP — 2005-10-23T13:58:22-05:00

It's too bad that Osama bin Laden makes the Mousilim faith look very BAD! But hey, what do I know, I am only Christian Orthodox.

Re: Science in Quran (the Proof it is the Truth)

AZEEM — 2005-10-23T13:43:17-05:00

~~~~~~~I'd love to see an Islamic country handle it the way this country has.~~~~~~
Yeah Pakistan people are alredy handling much bigger Disaster than Tsunami

~~~~~~If we were a third world country after two hurricanes, China'd be the
world economic leader right now -- oh, but we're not. We're still on top.~~~~~
On the Top of what??ENRON WORLDCOM etc yeah still on the Top in your Dreams my Friend in your Dreams

~~~~~~Yes, I'm sure they embargoed 70 F-14's and went on using the F-4's that they got from us too.~~~~~
They Whoo???(First think when you Type)
U.S.A Imposed the Arms embargo on Iran after the Iranian Revolution Iran don't even recieves spare parts of any US weapon in their arsenal including F-4s but they are maintaining all by themselves by making Duplicate parts just like Pakistan maintains its F-16s

~~~~~~Oh, and they sent their buddy AZEEM an e-mail telling them everything they've done, so he can win this debate.~~~~~
Lol man i thought you were Smart but nah your just a frustrated one

~~~~~~~~~~250+ million Americans provide our military much better money to buy much better weaponry.~~~~~~~~
Wepons dont mean Sh*t in Wars.War is won by strategies not just by Weaponry.You got weapons state of the Art ones & still you are crying Whele ig Oshama? LOL

~~~~~~Frankly, you seem dead-set on finding a violent solution to the problem that plagues the world, a problem which, for all intents and purposes,
you brought upon yourselves (aww snap, haven't you used that tagline on us before?) Violent situations aren't something
we're new to, and they're something we're quite good at handline.~~~~~~~~~
Frankly,i dont like Violence but sometimes violence is essential for those who dont understands what is said to them,

~~~~~~~ If it's war you want, then don't cry foul when we're kickin' your ass.~~~~~~~~
Its War you want you fired the first shot giving your trigger to our enemy you are the one who's cryin LoL Innoshent dead on 9/11 its War you want war we give you.If peace you want then appologize & stop aiding our enemies

~~~~~~~Since when did America make the first shot? We have every right to support Israel, even if it means supplying them
with weapons. It isn't an American who pulls the trigger that kills a Palestinian, it's an Israeli guy.~~~~~~~
How generous of u Americans to give weapons to our enemies & VITO what is right you deserve flower from all us Muslim nation yeah right!

~~~~~~Then you came over and did the 9/11 dealio, then bombed Madrid, then bombed London. Frankly, it's high time we nuked Mecca.
After all, don't we have a right to retaliate? ~~~~~~~
The perfect idiom on you is "Tail of a Dog is always arched" Lol you dont understand anything i said in previous posts did you?? what has Islam has to do with 9/11?? its all retaliatory but if you want then DO iT
Yeah do it whats stopping ya??Cowards Do it!ahhhh you dont have guts.Bythe way we also got Nukes what makes you think after nuking Makkah you'll be safe