Hardware Analysis - New Computer - What do you think?

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-13T14:25:13-05:00

Parts ordered. We'll see how they turn out.

Thanks to both of you, bot and Ford, for your help

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

BoT — 2008-01-13T00:42:28-05:00

Raynor said:

ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134

What I was looking at for CPU heatsink... any suggestions in that regard?

good

Thermalright Ultra-120 - $59.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835109125

better, even more so if you find the extreme version of it.
it's available, but not at newegg

SVC - http://www.svc.com/ultra-120-extreme.html
FrozenCPU - http://tinyurl.com/2saqu3

or

Tuniq Tower 120 - $44.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835154001

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T22:26:49-05:00

ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134

What I was looking at for CPU heatsink... any suggestions in that regard?

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T20:58:07-05:00

FordGT90Concept said:

What's after the decimal is the revision number. I didn't know 11's came out but basically it is saying it's newer and theoretically better. I can't tell any differences between the ones I do have so I probably couldn't tell any differences with 11 either. XD

It's an extra 15% cost for an extra 25% space over the .10 so I figure it's a good way to go.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

FordGT90Concept — 2008-01-12T11:24:17-05:00

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T09:57:29-05:00

What i'm seeing is the 7200.10 has a 16mb cache while the 7200.11 has a 32mb cache... any other differences?

Swapped the raptors for the 7200.11 500gb:
Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3500320AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

I'm betting on it having better performance than the 7200.10 400gb which got top marks in tom's hardware's review of HDs... it's also cheap and more than enough space

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

FordGT90Concept — 2008-01-12T09:44:14-05:00

Interesting. I was thinking of getting 2 36gb raptors as my boot partition and having a 80gb drive mirror the two... can that be set up?

Not with RAID.

The idea was faster boot/load times.

I have noticed that boot times are very dependant on drivers and updates. My 4000+ will load Windows XP in 1.5 scrolls of the bar. Place a Opteron 180 in the same socket and the performance plummets to a dozen+ scrolls.

Load times can be effected but really, how much is one second worth to you? That's what it really comes down to.

Only benchmarks would ever really show you the difference between RAID0/no RAID and 7,200/10,000 RPM.

If that isn't possible or is a bad idea i've heard some very good things about the seagate barracudas.

I currently have at least eight Seagate Barracudas (2 x 7200.7, 2 x 7200.9, and 4 x 7200.10 ES) and you will hear zero complaints from me.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T09:24:52-05:00

A RAID array of any type is only as fast as the slowest drive and the actual capacity is based on the smallest drive. In the case of RAID 0+1, you need at least four drives where two pairs of drives strip and the pair of strips is mirrored. RAID 0+1 does not mean RAID 1(RAID 0 + non-RAID). RAID 0 is only faster when reading or writing large chunks of data sequentially. When reading/writing small chunks, it is about the same speed; however, you run twice the risk (only one drive has to fail) of losing everything.

Interesting. I was thinking of getting 2 36gb raptors as my boot partition and having a 80gb drive mirror the two... can that be set up? The idea was faster boot/load times. If that isn't possible or is a bad idea i've heard some very good things about the seagate barracudas.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

FordGT90Concept — 2008-01-12T09:10:13-05:00

Raynor said:

1) Harddrives! I was thinking of WD Raptors in RAID 0+1 with a seagate 320 gb for the mirror... any thoughts on that? I know someone said they are only slightly faster... is that even while raided?

2) Cooling is still something I'd like to get suggestions on.

Keep it under 30 dB. For Kingwin parts, under 25 dB.

Raynor said:

3) Can anyone vouch for ClubIT? They offer G0 stepping Q6600s (which Newegg doesn't)...

Newegg might send you a G0 but they don't guarantee a stepping. Someone who got their Q6600 recently from Newegg should be able to tell you if the have started shipping G0s or not.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T08:32:30-05:00

Here is the UPDATED version. Like I said I'm hoping to buy tomorrow so I REALLY appreciate your guys' responses It's been really helpful.

Raynor said:

Alright so I have a full tower case already (Cooler Master Centurion, came with a 350W PSU)

The Basics:

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 G0 Stepping Kentsfield 2.40GHz 8MB L2 LGA 775 Processor Retail BX80562Q6600 SLACR
$277.99

Foxconn MARS LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
$186.99

EVGA 512-P3-N801-AR GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail
$259.99

Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3500320AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
$119.99

Kingston HyperX 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
$114.99 (89.99 after Rebate)

ENERMAX Liberty ELT500AWT ATX12V 500W Power Supply 90V~265V (Auto Adjusted) UL, cUL, TUV, CB - Retail
$114.99

Total cost:
$1074.94 (1049.94 after Rebates)

Now for the questions:

1) Cooling is still something I'd like to get suggestions on.

3) Can anyone vouch for ClubIT? They offer G0 stepping Q6600s (which Newegg doesn't)...

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

FordGT90Concept — 2008-01-12T07:42:10-05:00

Meats of Evil said:

If you want a good PSU and not so expensive buy this:
http://tinyurl.com/2sxr8r OCZ GameXStream 700w

Except for the massive cable mess. Once you go modular, you never go back. XD

Meats of Evil said:

I think you're wrong. Evey benchmark I see in every site the 880gt beats it. There are only a few games that the HD3870 gets a little bit more frames, it's so little difference that it doesn't matter. The price is excellent for the 3870 but if you like playing with AA on then buy a 8800gt or gts.

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.html?modelx=33&...;chart=288

It depends a lot on drivers. Sometimes HD 3870 is on top, some times it isn't. They seem well met but the 256 MiB 8800 GT is cheaper than the HD 3870.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

FordGT90Concept — 2008-01-12T07:39:17-05:00

Raynor said:

So now I'm looking at dropping SLI in favor of a single card (because I can get more upgradability of out it)... am I reading you guys right?

SLI works great in some games, about the same as a single card in others, and horrible in some. Generally, if you aren't pushing 1600x1200 (or equivalent) resolution or higher, SLI can potentially hurt more than help. It also involves a good bit of lolly gagging about to get it to work right. If you were looking at buying two 8800 GT cards right now, it might be worth it but, if you are looking to buy an 8800 GT now and another 8800 GT two years from now, that second 8800 GT will cost more than a new 10800 GT (or whatever) and perform slower than two 8800 GTs combined. SLI is really only practical for those that have the best (e.g. two 8800 Ultras) and it isn't good enough. It's a great way for NVIDIA to get more money from you and really not have much to show for it except a higher electric bill.

Raynor said:

I've been putting off building for almost a year now. Are they coming out @ $300ish? I'm concerned about shelling out more than that unless it's really worth it.

8800 GTS 512 MiB start at about $330:
http://tinyurl.com/2jqroy

HD 3870 starting at $230:
http://tinyurl.com/286war

Performance wise: HD 3850 < 8800 GT < HD 3870 < 8800 GTS 512 MiB

Raynor said:

If you think that'll carry the system (esp. if I drop SLI like bot was saying) I sort of looked that one over but the more I look at it the more I like it.

No SLI...

This should be sufficient:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194003

This should be slightly excessive:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194004

Raynor said:

The million dollar question (or in this case the $400 question). Should I invest in 4x1GB Corsair Dominators (or XMS2 kits) now or should I get my 4x1GB OCZ Golds (which are damn shiny xD) for $40 and hold off a year or two and then up the ram? $400 is like 30% of the total cost of the computer. Or maybe I should buy 1 kit of XMS2 and buy a second later... thoughts?

The OCZ Gold sticks are trash worthy especially for overclocking. If I were you, I'd get 2 x 1 GiB now and add another 2 x 1 GiB later. I think I'd go with these because the others are heading into the land of excess:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134218

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Meats of Evil — 2008-01-12T07:32:37-05:00

P.S

I suck at quoting.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Meats of Evil — 2008-01-12T07:29:21-05:00

If you want a good PSU and not so expensive buy this:
http://tinyurl.com/2sxr8r OCZ GameXStream 700w

FordGT90Concept said:

The HD 3870 is slightly faster than the 8800GT in most cases; the HD 3850 is slightly slower.

4) Overclocking. I know the Q6600 G0 can get to 3.6Ghz seemingly without breaking a sweat... I was thinking of going for 3.2Ghz and calling it good for now (hopefully that'll extend the processors life, since it's gonna be a kickass processor for awhile). Any tips/suggestions in that regard?

FordGT90Concept said:

You'll need very serious cooling in order to get close to that speed--both case and CPU. Also, in order to overclock the processor, you'll either need to use a divider on the memory or get better sticks (DDR2-1066 or better).

If you want to reach some speeds buy a decent Heatsink, you should read reviews from Thermaltake, Zalman and CoolerMaster. If you want to reach those speeds without a problem buy DDR2-800 minimum. And good brand.

The 680i might give you a headache overclocking Quads at certain speeds. Although 3.2ghz is easily done without too much work.

Re: New Computer - What do you think?

Raynor — 2008-01-12T07:15:53-05:00

AMD/ATI HD 3870 or HD 3850. If you can hold out for another month or two, NVIDIA is supposedly going to launch 9800 series cards which should be worth the wait. They're keeping very tight-lipped on things though. Perhaps you could also look at the 8800 GTS 512 MiB (320 and 640 are older GPU).

I've been putting off building for almost a year now. Are they coming out @ $300ish? I'm concerned about shelling out more than that unless it's really worth it.

It doesn't look bad but personally, I'd go with this Enermax Infiniti:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194022
It is more expensive and is deceptively weaker but when push comes to shove, it will go toe to toe with most "800w" PSUs out there.

If you think that'll carry the system (esp. if I drop SLI like bot was saying) I sort of looked that one over but the more I look at it the more I like it.

Overclocking memory is never cheap but here are some I'd look in to...
Newegg results: http://tinyurl.com/3d72nj